Old RP (Roundtable)

[Carillus]

Yeah, do you want to continue with the resurrection of the old RP or do you want to let it burn in the flames of Hell for NPC godmoding and other shit like that?

I don't give much of a fuck either way but lemme lay out some points:

1) I'm not calculating EXP anymore, it's a bitch to do, do it yourself and post it in your character thread or smth

2) If I see you giving yourself way more EXP than I thought you deserved I'm killing you off and dumping you in Tiger Dojo or smth

3) I'm not willing to control the fuckload of NPCs that make up the whole universe anymore because I take half a year to do so and when it's done people say it's horrible

4) Other people will have to take up this thankless role and take all the shit from everyone

5) No, I'm not coming up with scenarios anymore because my scenarios suck and they take fucking long to do, either other people do them or you can run around doing jackshit or whatever

6) More characters needed to fill the slots that are still open

7) Fuck it all, I'm revealing the damn RT Knight list for everyone to see - when I get around to actually bothering to do so

8) Courier thread closed because it's boring as a Math lecture at the start of fourth period

9) Kamin is a Mary Sue and don't you forget that

10) The RT storyline may start seeing integration with the proper Propella storyline - that means ODESA might make an appearance (if you read the wiki, you'll know who they are)

11) lol original chars in mah hueg crossover RP?

As you can tell I'm not terribly happy with resurrecting RPs but hey, I keep getting asked to do it so what the fuck right

Those were basically the reasons I hid the RP in the first place

[RaineScarlet]

Wow, I check and see that the board has suddenly become huge. Anyway, responses to some points.

1) I don't know why we had an exp / level system anyway. I'm sure people can gauge proper power levels relatively. Numbers always complicate things.

3) I don't think the NPCs were dull D: . It was quite interesting to read. I think the whole NPC thing would work better if every RPer were assigned a number of NPCs, or else there would be too much discrepancy. (Or too much work on one person's part, in this case).

5) The main problem with RT is, in my opinion, the fact that powers can consist of anything. There are no set limits because we all come from different worlds, and no one knows what a certain power is capable of until it is used and people start getting pissed off that they should or should not have landed a certain hit.

6) NPCs?

Well my main gripe with the RT RP was really that people had trouble limiting themselves and letting their imaginations run too wild. Points 1 and 3 also rely too much on the fact that every member is experienced enough to RP on the same level.

[Edit] Sort of off topic?

I thought Renai was executed better than RT was, because people could make their own NPCs, though some people did make more than others.

RT was influenced greatly by the NPC Controllers, and that can be taxing when only one or two people are doing everything. In most cases, whoever does all that NPC work usually does not also participate in the storyline. *stares*

Oh. I think what I'm trying to lay out is that Renai does some things well and RT also did some things well. If we could blend those elements together (not the RPs), then both RPs could benefit. So here, it may not seem like much, but it's for the tl;dr people to read [Pros on top, cons on bottom, whee]:

Renai
-Players make NPCs. Less work for admins.
-More familiar with school environment.

-Nothing's happening, or maybe the RP just started poorly...
-People are unnecessarily intrusive. Umm... desperate for attention?
-No action..? C'MON VAMPIRE KNIGHT FANS, WHERE ARE YO--*shot*

RT
-Interesting scenarios.
-Action / sense of despair (Hey, I think that's fun!).

-We don't know what we're doing half the time / not familiar with the Propella-verse
-Poor limiting / too much godmodding on players' part.
-Too much work for NPC Controllers.
-Exp system. Eh. EH. I've been complaining about this since the beginning of time. XD

*Actually, for both RPs, there's this issue with a HUGE number of NPCs that I can't keep track of, and they keep coming out of the woodwork. I don't know what I should think about that. I've always liked to start out small and slowly expand, instead of starting out with a large cast right away. Huge casts usually work better in... manga...

Now only if we all did something like aohc.deviantart.com/

[schrodinger]

Go ahead with it; it isn't unfeasible to run both RPs at the same time, considering that we enjoy a very leisurely pace of posting. The issues that have been raised with regard to the previous RP are similar to those that I identified back when it was running, but now that we've had the experience of a fairly different type (in terms of genre, at least) of RP, I think that there's something to be learnt from comparing one to the other.

Differences first: (I had walls of text for these at first, but I figured that sometimes less is more.)

- Genre shift.

Which provided a better experience, action or non-action? These are broad generalizations, but I think that they're quite apt descriptions of the two RPs.

- NPC involvement and control.

Central management or NPCs for everyone? Each of these has its issues - the problem with having just a few NPC Controllers has been raised by Raine, whereas the problem with allowing everyone to create NPCs for themselves is that it's a slippery slope to everyone just writing using their own characters - no interaction with other people's characters required.

Another issue with central management is that it feels way too much like everyone's just dancing to the tune of someone's private disco. Yes, we get it, you like the world that you've created - what author wouldn't be proud of their work? But by no means does this mean that it's the be-all and end-all of worlds, and the story that you want to tell isn't necessarily the one that provides the best experience for the players. I'm not criticizing your world or your story, but the way it's being inserted into the roleplay environment.

If you want to tell a story, tell it on your own terms, in your own voice. If, on the other hand, you want a group of people to be engaged in roleplay, there has to be some degree of involvement from each person in deciding which way the story goes - it can't be written in the world of one person alone.

- Character-driven / Plot-driven

This is probably a sweeping generalization, like with the genres, but as far as I could tell, the first RP was plot-driven whereas the current one is character-driven. It would be wrong to have an RP based on one of these aspects alone, so the question is, to what extent should either one of these influence the progress of the story?

- Gratuitous cameos / Originality

If the original premise of the first RP was that it would be fun to have a massive crossover between stuff that the NPC Controllers like, then I think that it's become fairly clear that the current RP - which is, as far as I can see, comprised of original characters - far surpasses it.

There is something to be said for the fact that Raine misses action in the current RP, but nobody bothered much with character relationships in the first one. (Perhaps the Vampire Knight fans are too busy watching and rewatching New Moon to bring any interesting action into the current RP.)

I'm all for bringing back the first RP on a more or less clean slate, given the circumstances that it was last seen in.

[RaineScarlet]

Jan 29, 2010 1:50:30 GMT 8 schrodinger said:

Another issue with central management is that it feels way too much like everyone's just dancing to the tune of someone's private disco. Yes, we get it, you like the world that you've created - what author wouldn't be proud of their work? But by no means does this mean that it's the be-all and end-all of worlds, and the story that you want to tell isn't necessarily the one that provides the best experience for the players. I'm not criticizing your world or your story, but the way it's being inserted into the roleplay environment.

If you want to tell a story, tell it on your own terms, in your own voice. If, on the other hand, you want a group of people to be engaged in roleplay, there has to be some degree of involvement from each person in deciding which way the story goes - it can't be written in the world of one person alone.

Maybe we should hold discussion boards for that then. Instead of having a set chain of events where nothing the players do would affect anything, we should opt to leave the event as open-ended as possible, so people can contribute their own material.

It's somewhat disheartening to find out that after all that RPing, all it takes is for one super powered NPC character to save the day. If you get what I mean.

Jan 29, 2010 1:50:30 GMT 8 schrodinger said:

- Character-driven / Plot-driven

This is probably a sweeping generalization, like with the genres, but as far as I could tell, the first RP was plot-driven whereas the current one is character-driven. It would be wrong to have an RP based on one of these aspects alone, so the question is, to what extent should either one of these influence the progress of the story?

QFT! Well mostly because this was one of the points I was trying to get at, but it was uber late at night so my brain was fried. XD

For RT, there was simply no time to sit down and find out any more than a person's name and face. We were all dragged from one event to another without so much as a lunch break. It was exciting, but somewhat... shallow, shall we say. In short: Moved too fast.

For Renai, we have er... too much time to to random idiotic things. Plus, from what I can see, there are a LOT of rules in place, most of which limit the freedom that the students have. True, it keeps the students from killing each other, but in the case with Venser's familiar, I hardly think that it warranted a deadly gun in the face.

Just my constructive criticisms. I still like to RP and will continue.. both? I'm not sure. I need to remember how to RP Sierra again. =_=

[Carillus]

Noted.

Clean slate? Shall we clear up the whole thing and remake it with more original characters then? I don't know anyone who's able to make a hundred plus OCs (I only have like forty) so I think we still have to have crossover characters - not a ton of them, but there nonetheless.

I appreciate the feedback from everyone. Once again, I never really liked the old RP because it was just too much work and I did railway it WAY too much. However, I'm not sure if we should scrap what we have at the moment. Can we jump forward to immediately after the Dragnea battle?

New base would be in New Technia, then.

[RaineScarlet]

Pretend the Dragnea battle never happened, you mean?

Instead of coming up with life or death scenarios, it would be nice to have a filler episode where we just find out more about everyone's personality. I think the stage is pretty well set for something similar to a clean slate anyway. Sierra got a rebirth of sorts, if I remember correctly. Venser is .. somewhere in limbo or whatever. Everyone else I'm not sure. They seem to be caught in the jumble of the Dragnea battle.

[NPC Controller 3]

I won't say pretend Dragnea didn't happen, but rather the event is over.

So I'm thinking of yanking everyone back to some major city, then you guys can look for or accept a new mission there.

However, some people are in a dilemma since they're 'out of phase' with the current verse, e.g. Venser.

People with characters in such circumstances, please state your views and if you don't like being yanked, try to clear up your side stories.

Thanks.

[Mathus]

Hmm, go ahead I guess and yea, RT was moving quite fast as compared to the current one.

[schrodinger]

Given that everyone accepts that there will be radical changes made in the way the RP is handled, it would make for a much more consistent new start if the events of the latest scenario had nothing to do with the beginning of the new one.

Indeed, it was the events of the last scenario that brought everyone to the realization that things had just gotten out of hand, so it would perhaps be more prudent for them to be treated with a collective shutting of one eye.

[theburntone]

Uh... is a time-machine okay?

[Phagetthree]

I don't think a time machine is going to help, it'll probably complicate matters.

Though I'd like things to get rolling before the year REALLY gets too busy for the rest of us.

FOR THE EMPEROR!

[Mathus]

Now we just wait till someone start the base thread, I guess.

[Carillus]

I'll do it soon.

[schrodinger]

What I mean is that the resolution of the current situation does not need to be explained by a plot device, since the abrupt nature of its ending makes including it in the story's canon a very strange decision. Bluntly put, it'd just be best for everyone to disregard the events of the last few threads or so.

[Carillus]

I do believe people have heard of the extremely convenient device known as the "TimeSkip". Cutting through long meandering periods of time with a few conveniently placed words or pre-determining the outcomes of things with a lengthy backstory.

This can be used to great effect here. Seeing as I also need to do the writeup for this particular aspect of the RP in the Wiki entry, I will therefore employ its use.

[schrodinger]

A timeskip is not required (what is that anyway), a time machine is not required, and the only few words that would simplify the entire event are "Nothing happened, move along." And then life goes on, preferably with a better direction to it.

[RaineScarlet]

Are we still going to use a number / exp system? T-T

[Carillus]

Nope. Screw that.

[Mathus]

Then, how do you define the power of a char? ._.

[Carillus]

I guess it's just generally how you feel now. How much you think your character should improve by judging by what you did and how it affected the outcome of a battle. It's mostly through your own discretion.

[Mathus]

Then we'll probably have some cases of powerleveling. Which I think I might do by accident. >_>

[Carillus]

Guardian system is still in place~ I'll tell you, anyway. Or anyone.

I hereby authorise anyone to state to others that they are powerlevelling / godmoding through the use of [[square brackets]] and OoCs. If warnings are ignored then shit will happen that will involve a lot of pain.

[RaineScarlet]

We should all have some idea of how powerful we are in relation to each other. For example...Sierra:

Worst offense
Below average speed/evasion [by using water, she expends mana]
Pretty good, if not best, physical defense
Poor magical defense, esp lightning
Best support
Most potential for creative attacks / catching people off guard

I guess it's easier for me to gauge something like this because of the way I created her. She's one of those extreme characters who sucks in one field but is great in another. For the rest of you average people, you'd have to look at the character list and compare yourself with someone else..

[Phagetthree]

The last bit of your post sounded a little condescending

Or maybe it's just me, stupid GP and its 8 periods a week.

[RaineScarlet]

I'm sorry? Perhaps I should have made it clearer. When I say average people, I mean characters who are more well-rounded. That is, average in all areas. If you still think that's condescending, then I'll have a bone to pick with you.